John Burke and his running mates say that they opposed giving part of County Route 44 to Kiryas Joel and that they will fight annexation.
It is true that Burke and Ralph Caruso were both against turning over Route 44, but neither of them offered any solutions.
Lorraine McNeil backed the compromise that SOCA-At-Work/OCEAN offered to the county which kept the road from being given away. See:
http://www.strausnews.com/articles/2007/09/13/photo_news/news/5.txt
As to annexation. So far, there has only been one petition ever filed to annex Woodbury land into Kiryas Joel. Neither Burke, nor Caruso, nor Haviland, nor Levine did anything about it.
Lorraine worked with us for months to convince the Kiryas Joel Alliance to drop the petition. See:
http://www.strausnews.com/articles/2005/05/18/photo_news/news/1.txt
and
http://archive.recordonline.com/archive/2005/05/11/truce11.htm
It’s easy to talk.
Actually getting results is a different matter.
It’s easy to make claims.
Backing them up with facts is a different matter.
Jonathan Swiller
It is true that Burke and Ralph Caruso were both against turning over Route 44, but neither of them offered any solutions.
Lorraine McNeil backed the compromise that SOCA-At-Work/OCEAN offered to the county which kept the road from being given away. See:
http://www.strausnews.com/articles/2007/09/13/photo_news/news/5.txt
As to annexation. So far, there has only been one petition ever filed to annex Woodbury land into Kiryas Joel. Neither Burke, nor Caruso, nor Haviland, nor Levine did anything about it.
Lorraine worked with us for months to convince the Kiryas Joel Alliance to drop the petition. See:
http://www.strausnews.com/articles/2005/05/18/photo_news/news/1.txt
and
http://archive.recordonline.com/archive/2005/05/11/truce11.htm
It’s easy to talk.
Actually getting results is a different matter.
It’s easy to make claims.
Backing them up with facts is a different matter.
Jonathan Swiller
35 comments:
Nicely done!
Burke & Haviland wouldn't know a fact if it him them in their heads!
This is exactly why John can't be given any cronies on the board.
Yeah to the Uncle and to the "Pieman" (why is Jonathan called the pieman?)
Lorraine is going to win and put those phonies to SHAME!!!!
I notice that all those comments were made within 6 minutes.
Either it's rush hour or one person has a lot to say.
As to Swiller, as I've said many times, that boy is sweet as pie!
Thanks for posting documented links and evidence, Uncle Betty. Appreciate your posting of flyers those of us currently out of town can't see directly (if you have more that would be great!).
I've been hearing plenty about the latest- no small bit being Burke's continued vow to "fight annexation." The fact that he's doing this when the Town Board NO LONGER HAS A ROLE in fighting annexation scares me. It seems to mean one of two things:
1)Burke and co. are continuing to use the scary "annexation" word to frighten voters (just like they did in the Village proposal, and numerous "scare tactics" in the past!)
2)He still doesn't know what his job and responsibilities are after all this time in office!
Neither bodes well for Woodbury, or the quality of his team.
As many have said in the past, check the facts, look at what's really being said and don't let last minute scare fliers sway your vote come Nov 6th.
when swiller keeps letting you know how great a person may be, it only means he has complete control of them and wants you to think they are great BEWARE !!!!!!!!!!!
Anyone there for the Harriman annexation meetings saw what role the Supervisor played- he sat in the audience like everyone else.
But he's happy to look very involved in his ads!
Please, Swiller doesn't "control" anyone. You're just jealous 'cause he can back up his statements with facts!
Considering how much control I have over people, you'd at least think that I'd get asked over to dinner from time to time.
I'm reading the Photo News, particularly "Bo" Haviland's letter with great amusement. Or should I say horror?
"If this were another part of the world, these persons would be called extremists and considered to be a threat to the democratic way of life"
Is he actually COMPARING HIS OPPONENTS TO TERRORISTS?! Sheesh! What a mature, "voice of reason" for our government!
As for his comment about signs, it doesn't even bear acknowledging. I've lived through enough elections to see which signs are the ones to go (Burke's first election being one of the worst in recent history). Don't throw stones in your glass house, Mr. Haviland. You might break a window.
And in the spirit of readily available sources, here's that letter:
http://www.strausnews.com/articles/2007/11/03/photo_news/opinion/9.txt
I'm sorry Jonathan- I think I still owe you a beer promised during the last election season fun! :P
Couldn't find the link Kieran, but I'd be happy to have the beer.
Yeah, little window cut things off...
http://www.strausnews.com/articles/
2007/11/03/photo_news/opinion/9.txt
So, Bo is standing up to the unknown "them" who don't want people to vote.
Very courageous.
I wonder who "they" are.
According to Bo "they will not allow the public to know that there are beliefs and opinions other than their own."
"They" must be very powerful to pull that off.
I wonder if they are related to the "they" who the President says "don't believe that al Qaida is a threat."
Or the "they" who "want us to lose in Iraq."
In other words, the same "they" who don't actually exist, but are really fun to stand up to.
I held onto to power for years denouncing the "they" who "would enslave us." Amazingly enough, no one ever asked who "they" were either.
Its a wonderfully classic tactic, from the middle-school bullies picking on the kid with the glasses to cover their own insecurities, to the highest seats of power. Hopefully, eventually people start to see through it.
To the Shithead who complains that "swiller keeps letting you know how great a person may be"
why don't you tell us what the f---you did for Woodbury
Anonymous said...
The dog park isn't a big thing for most voters, but Mike Aronowitz uses that in his publicity. I think Woodbury Junction is far bigger than a dog park, issue-wise, that is. You’re living in the past move on! Aronowitz like him or not he does work on projects to better the town. While all of you want to go back to 1950, get a life its 2007 I rather have a flip flopper then yes men which Bo and Levine will be to John. Yes men who don’t even know what their roles will be other then saying Yes John! Hey Bo and Levine the Village does zoning not the town you idiots. Maybe you two should run for Village seats or do you have to get permission from John?
Now, now...they would have to get permission from Manny and Bob.
Oh Johnny, Oh Johnny. Lest you forget that Haviland and Levine aren't in office yet so they didn't do those things. We all are still trying to figure out what you do. Perhaps you smooze the old ladies in your commune for $$$. But I digress.
It is interesting that it took months for Lorraine to reach an agreement. Talk about milking it. A good negotiator would have done it better. I'm sure her demeanor was the blame for the delay. Instead of talking to the other side of the table, she spits out venom and expects the opposition to roll over and give in. Instead they build up defensive that takes a while to break down.
Yes McNeil really helped.
First, my nickname is Jonny, not Johnny.
Second, the word is shmooze (alternate spelling schmooze). It basically means "to chat."
Third, the members of OCEAN aren't in office and yet we have been able to do a great deal. Haviland and Levine could have used their time to help. They didn't.
Fourth, as to what it is that I do, I think that we've covered that. If you need a more detailed response, send an email to us at nyocean@gmail.com and I'll send you the text of our latest newsletter.
Fifth, you claim that a good negotiator could have gotten the annexation petition dropped sooner. It took months because the KJA felt that they were giving up a lot. If they had been able to annex the land that they owned in Woodbury into KJ, they would have been able to break the monopoly that the vaad ha kirya has on property in the village. This would have weakened the people who currently run things. We had to convince them that the goodwill that they would earn would be worth it. So far, that hasn't been the case.
We - OCEAN, Lorraine and Sheila - spent months convincing the dissidents that we didn't share the knee-jerk antipathy towards all Chasidim that they have seen far too often. That while we would stand up to Szegedin and Wieder when they ignored the rights of their neighbors, we were prepared to judge each person on who he (or she) is, not how he dresses or where he lives.
It took patience, commitment and diplomacy. We built up mutual respect and trust. And in the end no part of Woodbury was annexed.
There are those of us who have earned the right to say "Not One Inch."
It's wonderfully easy to snipe, anonymously, from the shadows and make empty claims about how easy these things are. But from my viewpoint, you seem to have done nothing to protect Woodbury and you compound your uselessness by criticizing the people who have.
And yes, from time to time, I get testy.
Just fixing a typo, sorry!
Yeah, that wasn't cool. Though its easy to do with no name.
Thanks for telling it like it was, Jonathan. I also saw a little of what went into those negotiations, a rare case where communication and human respect managed to avert a difficult legal battle for everyone. Would that more of our local issues could be settled in that spirit.
All neighbors stand to enrich us greatly; I for one would be honored to have Hasidic families join my neighborhood. But the people of Woodbury also value our community- our towering trees, wildlife and open space for our children. To give that up would be to lose a part of ourselves. All we ask is for the same respect in turn.
Unfortunately such dialog seems all too rare... but I pray, for both our communities that we might see more of it. Its why we need leaders who've been there and can continue doing the hard work it takes.
Swiller, your still an a-hole!!
Are you kidding me, do any of you really think that Swiller would live in peace and harmony with a hasidic family next to him, open your eyes and ears! Swiller will continue to spread bullshit, write to the newspaper and whisper in everyones ears, If you really want to make a difference Swiller why don't YOU run for office, the answer is because YOU WOULD GET YOUR ASS KICKED! idiot!
Swiller is far from an idiot, and if you had even half a brain, you would clearly recognize that. Secondly, like myself, perhaps Swiller chooses to work from outside the ranks of those elected so that he is not bound by politics. In otherwords (since you've shown how difficult it is for you to understand) he has the freedom to question and speak openly, without the bullshit that party leaders like Caruso and Manguel would bind him by. Smart man who has been able to achieve much more than it appears you can ever even dream of!
"Outside the ranks" okay Town employee! Not bound by politics! Your giving yourself away, "Smart Guy" keep tellin yourself that, somebodys probably whispering in your ear also!
Wrong again-- no relation. Why, in your book, does everyone have to either be an elected official or a town employee if they're posting here? You're ridiculous. And for the record, the only one whispering in my ear is my spouse!
No one seems to have picked up some other strange disparities in Mr. Burke's and his team's campaign materials and the interview in Saturday's Record.
1) People have mentioned, correctly, that Mr. Burke and his team have put out on their materials that they will oppose any annexation. People have correctly also pointed out that the Town has nothing to say about this matter since all zoning and planning rest with the Village. Woodbury does not get 2 votes--one from the Town and one from the Village. Only the Village votes. One has to ask, does Mr. Burke really know that he has no say in this (ignorance of his duties) or is it a political ploy to win? Not acceptable either way.
2) Mr. Burke, from the interview, also seems to think that it is part of his job to "monitor" the Village government and speak out if he does not like what they do. Since when is that part of the Supervisor's job? He made a fine mess of the water tank property situation with KJ=== claiming that he told them they couldn't use the property in 2 letters and then not following up. Now he is blaming the Village which did not even exist when all of this started last year. Shouldn't he also have contacted other County officials, such as the County Clerk's office which files deeds, that this was an illegal subdivision? Instead he huffed and puffed but really did nothing because he is a public relations supervisor with little knowledge of the job. while he keeps referring to being a principal, that does not prepare one for being supervisor. The jobs are not interchangeable and require very different knowledge. Clearly, Mr. Burke did not know the channels to pursue and is now trying to blame things on another government body, namely the Village. He should spend more time learning his own job and leave the Village alone.
3) Has nobody noticed another disparity? Mr. Burke talks about keeping taxes down and yet he is increasing his own salary for next year while his responsibilities are decreasing as the Village, by law, must take over more government responsibilities. As of June 2007, zoning and planning no longer are under the Town. By the end of the year, as I understand it, water and sewer go over to the Village. Why is Mr. Burke giving himself a raise when his job is shrinking? How is this holding down taxes? What should happen is that as the supervisor's duties shrink, so should his salary which should shift over to the Mayor whose duties are increasing. The total for the 2 of them should not exceed what one was receiving before the creation of the Village. If the supervisor has lost 30- 40% of his duties by the end of the year, then that amount of salary should shift over to the village salaries and the supervisor's salary should decrease by the same amount. Mr. Burke should certainly not keep the same salary and then take an additional increase. Who is kidding who here? Disgraceful!!
The saddest part is that we do not really have a choice for the supervisor's position. Government and the people always lose when they have no choice. With part of the Republican Committee supporting Burke behind the scenes in the last election, nobody even bothered coming forward from that party this year. The only choice we do have is to not vote for Burke which is a way to register a protest for the lack of a choice. The voters are being held hostage by a small group of people on 2 political committees that want to control the Town from behind the scenes. If people only knew what really goes on they would be angry and disgusted.
Boy, if we go to a Village meeting and seriously question them on why they are not taking over everything might do the trick. Ralph and crew asked for this. Now they should receive their just rewards. It would also eliminate the need for much of this discussion.
I agree that people should be angry that we do not have a choice in the supervisor's race this year. For all of his scolding and criticizing of previous Board's. Mr. Burke has done very little. He does get his name in the newspaper, but if you look carefully, he has not done much in 2 years. All of his talk about open government is just that: talk. He has had more closed meetings than any supervisor in memory. And last year's budget process was not open. He held meetings with department heads during the day when nobody who works could attend. He claimed it was to save overtime. But perhaps it was because he didn't want people to see how little he knows.
I would be willing to spend money on overtime so that we could hear the Board discuss the budget openly. But then we would have known sooner that Mr. Burke was giving himself a raise when his job is declining and guess we would not want that out there too far before the election so people could question that. Just think, we are paying Mr. Burke about $1,000 per week while his job is declining. Maybe more people would run for the job if they knew they could have a salary that increases as your job responsibilities decrease. Nice work if you can get it. And you can, if both political parties in Town work to ensure that you are the only candidate.
You are correct. We are stuck with Burke, but can show our disgust by not voting for that line on the ballot.
Hey, Uncle Betty, I hope you will go to high alert if another one of those unsigned fear flyers appears just before the election. Last time, an unsigned flyer arrived on people's doorsteps just before the election making all kinds of wild claims that thousands of acres of land in Town were going to be rezoned to high density housing. Of course, it wasn't true, none of it. But it benefited Burke and likely helped his election. Any legitimate campaign literature should identify who is sending it so people should look for that first off.
Please alert us if any such nonsense surfaces this year.
By the way, it sickens me when people criticize others, including yourself, who worked to peacefully resolve the earlier annexation. You, McNeill and Conroy did resolve that and people are trying to now criticize the 3 of you for actually accomplishing something without having to go to court and even saving the taxpayers money?
Is it also true that one of the people running with Burke in the last election complained to the State that you guys had improper meetings with the annexation sponsors? Did Burke speak out about his own running mate hurting the Town by doing this? If he didn't, then clearly he put politics before the good of the Town.
Someone said that people who become involved in politics before they become involved in public service do not serve their constituents well. That saying seems to apply in Woodbury.
Ditto for the Highway Super. Choice is always good.
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